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[wagdoll]

Edited

[Esperanza]

Oh good grief!  How did that man get out of the assylum? 

Absolutely no concept or understanding of 3rd party affiliates.  This is the knowledge and mentality of someone running a program with a PTP? 

I hope it isn't contagious.

My thoughts exactly 

This man is clearly delusional. Either it's 3rd party affiliate advertising on ALL Vale PTP pages OR it's the PTC's of this one particular member that offended him - PTC's which are probably for PTP or affilliate pages and were without a doubt tested by Inya before she added them to his affiliate page.

As for this being contagious: only in close contact I think, considering that until now I have only seen Darlene backing up this lunacy.

I have many such tools and never give out the secrets, names or abilities of these tools.

Clearly he doesn't understand either that no matter how many 'secret' tools you use, they never should replace common sense.

[php25]

This is my post from GPF:

My account was suspended to!
I would like to publish my story with John!
A few days ago I had made a redemption on globalworldmails.com “Page impressions on Paid-to-Promote Rotator:20000 Page impressions” for my valeptr affiliate page and got strange response from John:

“This page contains virus and downloaders. Nice try. Your account is suspended. Pass this onto your friends. John”

I was shocked by such a response! And wrote to him:

“Hello!
I have made redemption
Page impressions on Paid-to-Promote Rotator:20000 Page impressions - $0.99
to my valeptr affiliate page
This is my affilate page of valeptr I am not admin of this site! Why you
suspended my account? What is my fault?
I do not know that it contains, on this page only my ptp banners. Dismiss my
redemption and activate my account please. Thanks!”

Idiotic response from John

“Don't give me that line of ######, Igor. You purchased an ad for YOUR affiliate
page. YOUR ads YOUR page. Don't blame valeptr for it. I will deal with
them shortly. Don't come to my site(s) trying to pass off your nonsense.
You should be aware of what you advertise -- everyone else is. You are
responsible. I don't have time to fix the problems you cause with your
irresponsibility or criminal intent. Be thankful I only suspended your
account.
If you decide to signup again, I strongly recommend the following:
Give it about 60 days before you try to signup again. We don't want the
database to kick you out for duplicate account information. In the
meantime, please read the Terms, Help and Home pages so that you thoroughly
understand the rules.
John”

I give him a more detailed explanation

Hello you had suspended my account for my valeptr affiliate
page. Reason -"This page contains virus and downloaders" Please tell me
what antivirus do you use?
I use Kaspersky internet security 2009, he is one of the best! And i don't
find any viruses or downloaders on my affiliate page! Please show me the
HTML code of this page that containes viruses.
Do you understand that advertising on these pages are targeting and possibly
what you see on my affiliate page I can not see because we live in different
countries. Think about it! Anyone of the promoters, with all its desire not
been able to track the contents of all PTP and affiliate pages. There are a
moderators, who clearly has the right to reject an infected page, and even
banned the site to which it belongs. For example, the admin shareadspace.com
doing so. And it does not give you the right to suspended or delete members
who redeem for ads, because this member is not formed its contents, which
are also not static.

Defiant response from John

Hey Igor,
You said your piece.
You're done here.
I told you to pass this information onto your friends. Just go do that.
Move on.
Now pay attention. This...thread...is...closed.
John

With the permission of admin valeptr I want to publish our correspondence
My letter to Admin of valeptr to cry for help:

Hello!
I have a problem, will you so kindly to help me.
A few days ago I had made a pedemption on globalworldmails.com “Page impressions on Paid-to-Promote Rotator:20000 Page impressions” for my affiliate page  and got strange response “This page contains virus and downloaders. Nice try. Your account is suspended. Pass this onto your friends. John” I was shocked by such a response! Help me to solve this problem, please contact the admin of globalworldmails.com. http://www.globalworldmails.com/pages/contact.php
I use Kaspersky internet security 2009, he is one of the best. And i dont find any viruses or downloaders on my affiliate page. I do not know that my affiliate page shows the American.
Thanks!

Her reply, in which she fully supports me

Hi Igor,
It's terrible, how you are treated at globalworldmails! Unbelievable!!!
I am very sorry, they just took your ValePTR affiliate page as a reason to cancel your account.
I have no report about nasties from the third party ads at our affiliate pages just now from any other side. It's running at SAS and other PTR sites with updated banned lists.
I don't know any honest PTR site, which _cancels_ a member's account, if a PTP or affiliate page of another PTR site contains any nasties. They may reject this ad order of course and set the other PTR site on their banned list, but has nothing to do with a _member's_ account.
So, in my eyes it seems to be only a pretext for cancellation of your account. :-(
Perhaps we should make this issue public at globalfriendsonline forum?
Greetings,
Adminya

As a result, we have:
I believe that the admin globalworldmails.com people are not competent in respect of promotional sites. Plus to everything, he still does not know how to politely interact with people.

[mommablue33]

rbnlovespoh: You have never been a member of any of John’s sites long enough to even think about being paid. I seem to recall you don’t stay in sites longer than 2 weeks at a time. You change your mind more than anyone I ever saw.

Esperanza: No, John has no respect for that joke called the boycott watch/ban list. Honest people who go to that place only get a bashing so how could anything on any list they have be called a fraud when the whole forum is a fraud? I do totally agree with John about the boycott. (not that I agree with all John says or does)

wagdoll: There has been several PO’s contact John asking where to obtain his English tests. Just because some (who can’t read English well) don’t like those tests doesn’t mean other people disagree with those types of tests.

nitinkumar: Some of those tests are hilarious!

Spitfire: When an ip is 600+ miles from the address that is in the account and not even the same state and changes at regular intervals throughout the day from state to state, always several hundred miles apart it sure does get suspicious. Either the member is a bird with a laptop on their back or they are changing their ip at will to beat the normal checks.

cybertongue: Yes Ma’am, it is me.

Spitfire: If I remember correctly I responded to you and told you the pops were from Sheri, the previous owner of those sites and I removed those. If there is still pops on the pages, neither you nor anyone else has complained since that one time.

I know about ISP that changes ips so their customers can slip through various loopholes, that is why most honest PTR sites do not allow proxy use, including AOL.

I have not removed any member that was honest to keep from paying them.

I have nothing to do with how John runs the sites in his group. If he feels a member is a cheat that is his decision and not mine. He also does not tell me how to run the sites in my group.

iamannoyed: Just to let you know, our sites are ‘Paid to READ’. This does mean that somewhere out of the hundreds of emails members get they should be reading them.  Yes, there were paid ads sent out on some of our sites, no different than those that were sent on various other programs leading to this topic in this forum.

Inya: Did you ever stop to think that just maybe the problem ad that John and I saw was NOT targeted to your country? Not all ads are targeted to Germany and other non-USA countries. You as a webmaster yourself should know that and listen when a person from outside your country reports bad ads. John banned your site at YOUR request. You told him to ban it. You as good as told John that you wanted your members to spread nasty stuff through their affiliate pages on your site instead of making sure the member’s ads were not full of trash to infect computers.

Jeanene: Full details of John’s findings have not and never will be posted for public viewing.
Esperanza: You hit the nail on the head! The member was trying to run trashy ads that he/she had on their affy page that the owner of the site did not see(possibly because of their country not being targeted to see them). But the owner of the website did not care how many USA people got this trashy ad that was infecting their computers.

I have more than one partner. I do not agree with everything either of them do just as they do not agree with all I do.

php25: Some of the ads you had running on your affy page were trashing computers of people in the USA. Maybe you were unaware of that if you are not a USA citizen. John tested your page. He asked me to test it. I got trash as he did. We then proceeded to test other pages from other members from the same site, all were clean. We then went back to your page again and still got the nasties loading. So this is NOT one of those ads that is a 24 hour hit. It seemed to be a fulltime nasty.

I have no idea why John’s reaction to you or anyone else was harsh, I can not speak for him as he is his own person. 


Now, for everyone else reading…

You are calling for a ban of John and all his programs. There are 3 partners, John, Erwin, and myself(Darlene). Does this ban stand for all of us? If so, then a lot of you will be banning one of your top promoters and clickers. You will also be banning sites that you, yourselves are upgraded members of. Not to mention that all of you have always been paid by me on any site that I run or have ever run.

This just sounds to me like another one of those revenge bans.

John does not agree with how I do some things. I do not agree with how he does some things. Erwin does not agree with some things I do and I do not agree with all he does.  LOL, Erwin is in a lot of sites I would never join simply because I do not agree with the owner.

[iamannoyed]

darlene: just to let you know....I am well aware of what your sites are or are not as I  belong to FIVE of them and am upgraded at four of them.  One of which I am choosing to leave (that is IF he ever runs my redemption ad) because of the PO's harsh treatment of long term HONEST members and long term HONEST program owners

Just a question: do YOU scroll down to read the signatures of every email sent by every program you belong to? If not, then why do you expect your members to do something you aren't willing to do as a member?

and I have been a ACTIVE clicker who DOES actually READ the ads since 2001 and a PO since 2003 (owned 8 PTRs and 3 search engines over the last 6 years, am currently an admin at another site) so there is no need to talk down to me like i am some newbie idiot who doesn't have a clue about anything, thank you so much

[wagdoll]

Edited

[mommablue33]

Yes, I do read the emails I am paid to read. I hate to say it but it sure looks bad when a PO says they don't read emails  That is like saying 'hey members, you don't have to read anything in my sites, just click and run!'

It is always best to at least 'skim' through any and all paid emails because different types of emails from the same site can have different headers and footers with different info in them.

I co-own or solely in excess of 30 sites that are not limited to PTR & engines. I am not by far a newbie in PTR or search engines.

[mommablue33]

So if those who don't read English well are the ones who don't like the tests, you're saying I don't read English well? Okay... Whether or not some people find them hilarious or clever isn't the point, they are too clever to be used for that purpose on an international site. One of the tests was all dependent upon the placement of a hyphen and a capital letter to be able to get the right answer - that's taking it too far imo.

I have no idea how well you read English or any other language. John does his English tests his way, not mine.

There's a huge difference between the proxies that AOL uses and the open proxies cheats use. Most of the sites that disallowed AOL type proxies did it out of ignorance or because the search portals didn't bother to differentiate so they made that rule so as to get good results at the SEs because most of their ads were portal ads.

I know of at least one country that uses AOL via university backbone links. This means members from that country can and do mimic US/UK/CA traffic sometimes by using the AOL proxy.

From what I saw, Inya asked for details so she could make sure all the pages were clean, but when the details weren't forthcoming she had no option but to suggest the site be banned if that's what John felt he needed to do. How could she deal with it when all she was told was that it was coming from one of the clean html banners? What was the problem, where are the codes to support this accusation? All the member's banners showing on that page now are clean html banners with no iframes or scripts. The only banners with scripts are the third party ads. If Inya had added an iframe or script for the member, wouldn't she admit it rather than have her site banned at John's sites?

I have already said that I can't speak for John or how he deals with his members. I will say that Inya asked John to ban her site.

[wagdoll]

Edited

[mommablue33]

Those are very good non-answers.

Regardless of your one example of AOL that does not mean all honest POs need to ban all of those type of ISP proxies.

You have made some strong accusations and now you don't even seem willing or able to back them up. Are you getting a little less sure of things yourself?

How would you feel if your personal account was banned at a site because there was a bad third party ad in one of your PTPs and the PO couldn't tell the difference? Or maybe for that 0 iframe autosearch that was (is?) running in one of your rotators for months? What if you were banned from a site for botting, when you know you don't? Do you have that kind of empathy to at least understand where these complaints are coming from?

I think you are mistaken. I have not made any accusations.

  Maybe you do have a problem reading English if you think I have made accusations.

[wagdoll]

Edited

[mommablue33]

If you are referring to...

Regardless of your one example of AOL that does not mean all honest POs need to ban all of those type of ISP proxies.

I can not speak for the millions of site owners out there, but I myself prefer to have non-proxy traffic for the advertisers that prefer non-proxy traffic.

By having non-proxy traffic, the chances of dishonest members with duplicate accounts are greatly reduced.

[pancra]

I'm not a PO. English is not my native language. I'm probably pretty dumb, but still I must ask:

If I go around, in the "real world", accusing someone of being a thief without showing proper proof. Will someone believe me? Will the authorities (police, judges, etc) pay any attention to me? Won't I be expected to produce a proof of such wrongdoing?

Is the PTR world really so different from the real world?

[wagdoll]

Edited

[Esperanza]

Esperanza: No, John has no respect for that joke called the boycott watch/ban list. Honest people who go to that place only get a bashing so how could anything on any list they have be called a fraud when the whole forum is a fraud? I do totally agree with John about the boycott. (not that I agree with all John says or does)

Yes, many of us remember both of you and the way you handled yourselves when you were refused your instant gratification at Boycott... especially your 'gracious' comment to us to eat bovine excrements...

Inya: Did you ever stop to think that just maybe the problem ad that John and I saw was NOT targeted to your country? Not all ads are targeted to Germany and other non-USA countries. You as a webmaster yourself should know that and listen when a person from outside your country reports bad ads. John banned your site at YOUR request. You told him to ban it. You as good as told John that you wanted your members to spread nasty stuff through their affiliate pages on your site instead of making sure the member’s ads were not full of trash to infect computers.

Esperanza: You hit the nail on the head! The member was trying to run trashy ads that he/she had on their affy page that the owner of the site did not see(possibly because of their country not being targeted to see them). But the owner of the website did not care how many USA people got this trashy ad that was infecting their computers.

<snip>

php25: Some of the ads you had running on your affy page were trashing computers of people in the USA. Maybe you were unaware of that if you are not a USA citizen. John tested your page. He asked me to test it. I got trash as he did. We then proceeded to test other pages from other members from the same site, all were clean. We then went back to your page again and still got the nasties loading. So this is NOT one of those ads that is a 24 hour hit. It seemed to be a fulltime nasty.

Darlene, I simply don't buy it. This is a very active community where it concerns catching and reporting nasties yet John and you are the only ones who have 'seen' this one - and may I point out that neither of you have provided any specifics or even evidence like source code. All we have is John's ramblings (because that is all I have seen from him until now) about his 'secret tools' plus reports about the unscrupulous way he victimises downlines of supposed bot users he caught.
For all intents and purposes, and mainly due to his own words and actions, it looks like John is an incompetent program owner who is doing some creative damage control.